October 2, 2013 at 5:57 am #97379
As you make it through Hump Day, don’t forget JJP at TWIB.
Drop those links. Engage in debate. Give us trivia and gossip too.
And always, have a peaceful dayOctober 2, 2013 at 5:58 am #97380
Good Morning, EveryoneOctober 2, 2013 at 6:01 am #97381
Hello rikyrah!October 2, 2013 at 8:50 am #97382
Hope you join us on the thread later on today, BenOctober 2, 2013 at 8:52 am #97383October 2, 2013 at 8:54 am #97384October 2, 2013 at 8:58 am #97385
Are House Republicans looking for a way out?
By Greg Sargent, Updated: October 1, 2013
One thing that’s gotten lost in the noise over the government shutdown is an inconvenient bit of history: Before House GOP leaders decided to placate the hard liners by using a shutdown threat to chip away at Obamacare, people close to them let it be known they thought this was politically dangerous to the GOP.
Remember that? It happened. In August, GOP pollster David Winston — who has been close to the House GOP leadership for years — let it be known that his polling showed broad public opposition to a shutdown. Winston also told Robert Costa that House Republicans needed to produce their own alternative to Obamacare, because “the electorate expects Congress to govern.”
And yet, House GOP leaders — after internally advocating against a shutdown/defund Obamacare fight, and then reversing course and deciding to placate conservatives by waging one – have gone all the way to closing the government.
I asked Winston whether he still thought this was a dangerous course for the GOP.
“At some point in time, Senator Cruz and his allies are going to have to define an endgame that’s successful,” Winston told me. “And they haven’t done that yet. If they don’t, then this is going to have to be resolved some other way.”
“A long term shutdown is not a tenable solution in the eyes of Americans,” Winston continued. “They expect the President and Congress to govern. All the parties involved had better realize there are repercussions here. The biggest concern people should have is the level of uncertainty this injects as voters think about who they are going to choose in 2014. People should be concerned about what that will look like.”
If you look closely at what Winston is saying, it suggests House Republicans will have to find a way out of this battle that isn’t going to involve giving conservatives what they want on Obamacare. As Winston puts it, conservatives have not figured out how to get to the “endgame” they want. Translation: They can’t get what they want. And as Winston notes, a long term shutdown is not tenable. So what’s left as an option?October 2, 2013 at 9:00 am #97386
Dems to GOP: No Obamacare extortion. Period, full stop.
By Greg Sargent, Updated: October 1, 2013
House Republican leaders are now making it be known that they want to “negotiate” a way out of the government shutdown crisis. It’s unclear what Republicans would be willing to concede in this negotiation — if anything — and it’s also unclear why Democrats would want to be drawn into a negotiation in which only they are expected to make concessions. But that’s what Republicans are claiming. Other reports suggest Republicans may start to vote on bills funding the government piecemeal to ease political fallout from a shutdown.
In an interview with me today, Dem Rep. Chris Van Hollen responded to all the GOP chatter: No negotiations that tie funding of the government to the undermining of Obamacare. Period, full stop. Van Hollen also suggested current signs from the House GOP may mean the government could remain shut down for weeks — with the shutdown ultimately getting tied up in the debt limit fight, escalating the stakes enormously.
“We’re not going to negotiate the dismantling of Obamacare as part of keeping the government open,” Van Hollen said. “We are not going to go to a conference where they are threatening to shut down the government unless we derail the Affordable Care Act.”
Van Hollen said that if Republicans want to enter into budget negotiations, there’s a simple way to do that: Pass a clean CR funding the government at current levels, and enter into normal budget talks. He said Dems would likely support a clean CR in high enough levels for it to pass.
“We believe enough Dems can combine with some Republicans to pass a clean 6 week extension,” Van Hollen said. “Why has Speaker Boehner refused to allow a vote on a clean CR? The answer is his Tea Party wing is worried it will pass and we will keep the government open.”October 2, 2013 at 9:01 am #97387
King: 30 to 40 GOP lawmakers refuse to admit legitimacy of Obama’s presidency
By Jonathan Easley – 10/01/13 09:14 PM ET
People are willing to demonize Obama because he’s from a different party, Rep. Peter King (R-N.Y.) said.
Rep. Peter King (R-N.Y.) said Tuesday that there are about 30 to 40 Republicans in Congress who refuse to recognize the legitimacy of Obama’s presidency and are seeking to erase everything that’s happened during his administration.
King made the remarks in a discussion with Chris Matthews on MSNBC’s Hardball, after the host asked how many Republicans would like to “erase [Obama’s] record as if he was never here.”
“I’ve had members, they know who they are, they say – ‘I really can’t say with these lips that this man, Barack Obama, was elected president’,” Matthews said. “They choke on that. How many are there in Congress on your side that represent that rejectionist front?”
Read more: http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/326017-king-30-to-40-gop-lawmakers-refuse-to-admit-legitimacy-of-obamas-presidency#ixzz2gZLx0AJU
Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on FacebookOctober 2, 2013 at 9:02 am #97388
How GOP’s Desperate Anti-Obamacare Push Backfired and Helped Spread the Word
Tuesday, October 01, 2013 | Posted by Spandan C at 5:02 PM
As Americans rush to check out their options and sign up for their piece of Obamacare, right wingers are desperate to find any straw to grasp. To that end, they have all been hilariously complaining that Obamacare is “not ready for prime time” because – get this – Healthcare.gov and state exchanges have had glitches due to overwhelming traffic. To follow their logic, the Affordable Care Act is a failure because people overwhelmingly want it. The GOP’s main TV propaganda outlet, Fox News, is helping out with a running tally of these glitches, although as far as I can tell, they have no interest in actually getting people signed up.
But the Republicans may have helped the rush of people going to the exchanges, looking up their options, and signing up. For 3.5 years constantly since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, Republicans have consistently and continuously bashed the law, tried to repeal it some 45 times, and blamed it for everything but your kid’s bad grades in school.
At some point, if you raise enough stink, people get curious. They want to know what all the freakout and the hoopla is about. When they are constantly being told that the sky is going to fall, you can’t blame them for peaking outside to see if the heavens are actually collapsing. The Republicans may have generated bad buzz about Obamacare, but they still generated buzz. And this buzz isn’t the kind that can be covered up with the propaganda forever. This is actually about real things happening to real people, and these real people have an actual way to find out what is going to happen to them. There’s this thing called the Internet, and there’s this central site called Healthcare.gov that allows people to actually see what they’re going to get.October 2, 2013 at 9:04 am #97389
October 01, 2013 3:55 PM
Democratic Plan B
By Ed Kilgore
After worrying about the impact of false equivalence reporting of the government shutdown saga this morning (which I more succinctly described in a tweet as “false equivalence promoted by high-exposure pundits to low-information voters”), I’ve been hearing all day from friends fretting about the same thing.
So let’s game-plan this out and imagine that Republicans hang tough and begin to gain public traction from fatigue with “Washington partisanship” and a desire for “negotiations.” Is there a Plan B for Democrats other than continuing to point out what is actually going on?
Well, I’m normally not a fan of meeting asymmetrical polarization with counter-polarization, but this may be an exception. What if Obama and/or congressional Democrats say, “okay, we’ll broaden the negotations to consider your demand to delay or change Obamacare, but only if you consider our demands for an immediate House vote on the Senate-passed immigration bill and the Manchin/Toomey gun background check bill and a major minimum wage increase!” If the public’s going to view every dispute in Washington as political wrangling, maybe Democrats should politically wrangle over high-stakes policy disputes that don’t amount to degrees of the conservative agenda.October 2, 2013 at 9:05 am #97390
The man without a plan
By Steve Benen
Wed Oct 2, 2013 8:00 AM EDT
As Day 2 of the government shutdown gets underway, the congressional Republicans who thought this would be a good idea find themselves lacking something important: a plan.
Late yesterday, House GOP leaders decided they’d try piecemeal funding — a Ted Cruz strategy built around “mini CRs” — providing funds to the parts of the government Republicans kind of like, while leaving everything else shut down. Democrats balked, but the House voted on the idea last night anyway. As expected, it failed, but Republicans intend to bring the same measure to the floor today, because … well, they don’t really have anything else to do.
There is, of course, the Senate bill, which is a center-right proposal embraced by Senate Democrats and the White House, and which enjoys bipartisan support in the House. If House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) brought it to the floor for a vote, it would very likely pass and the shutdown would be over.
So why doesn’t the flailing Speaker just end this misery that enjoys the support of a Senate majority, a House majority, and President Obama? Because as Robert Costa reported last night, Boehner would prefer to see the shutdown continue.October 2, 2013 at 9:06 am #97391
Time Stops for No One
Wed Oct 2nd, 2013 at 08:20:54 AM EST
David Drucker, writing in the right-wing Washington Examiner, chooses to emphasize the divisions in the Republican Party and to amplify the message of the dissenters who never wanted a fight over ObamaCare that could lead to a government shutdown. He uses some math that is becoming familiar:
The growing group of lawmakers was publicly silent until now, voicing concerns privately only to their GOP colleagues while publicly rallying around the proposal, in part, to ensure the GOP caucus maintained a united front. With the government now closed and Democrats refusing to negotiate any changes to Obamacare, these Republicans are saying flatly that they’ve had it…
…There are 233 Republicans in the House, and most of them never approved of using the threat of a government shutdown to slow Obamacare, a strategy spearheaded by Sens. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, and Mike Lee, R-Utah, and adopted by a few dozen House Republicans. It was plainly obvious that the GOP did not have the 60 votes needed to advance the bill in the Democratic Senate and Republicans didn’t have enough votes in either chamber to override President Obama’s certain veto.
The “few dozen” number puts the size of the Tea Party suicide brigade at somewhere between 36 and 60, which corresponds to the other number I keep seeing (180) for the dissenting faction. With 233 members, perhaps 53 are in favor of the shutdown and 180 are against it.
If the numbers are indeed that lopsided, it doesn’t bode well for the long-term cohesiveness of the House GOP. Yet, so far, almost of all the House Republicans who have been willing to go on the record are from culturally blue states or are representing a lot of government employees. I wouldn’t describe all these members as politically vulnerable, as most of their districts are drawn to be safe. But they are culturally alienated. You can be fairly invulnerable in your gerrymandered district in the Philly suburbs, but that doesn’t mean you can explain yourself or your party at the supermarket. As for the Virginia lawmakers with a lot of government employees, they are completely freaking out.October 2, 2013 at 9:08 am #97392
Rachel Maddow: GOP always planning to shutdown the governmentOctober 2, 2013 at 9:09 am #97393
Wingnuts Roasting On An Open Fire
Tue Oct 1st, 2013 at 08:08:06 PM EST
As I have pointed out repeatedly, the following is not technically true.
Washington correspondent for The New Yorker Ryan Lizza said Boehner has to bring Republicans some concession – the medical device tax, or a shorter delay of the individual mandate, for example – if he wants to preserve his job.
In other words, Boehner cannot put forward a bill that funds the government, without some sort of Obamacare concession attached.
“The consensus seems to be that if he puts a clean continuing resolution on the floor, and gets no concessions whatsoever after shutting down the government, that he will lose his job as Speaker,” said Lizza. “That’s the bind he’s in right now.”
The Speaker of the House is elected by the whole chamber and, by the rules, does not even need to be an actual elected member of Congress. The Republicans could make Clint Eastwood or Rob Schneider the Speaker if they wanted to. And the Democrats could assure that Boehner keeps his job either by voting for him or by abstaining from the vote, or by some combination of both.
What this means is that Boehner can, at any time, decide that he can’t effectively lead the Republican Party but he can lead the House. The Democrats would have every reason to agree to that arrangement, because there are enough reasonable Republicans in the House to pass immigration reform and to restore the old system of using the appropriations committees to make sensible investments for the future, and to raise the debt ceiling, and perhaps even to do some (very) minor gun violence control legislation.
If Ryan Lizza is correct that Boehner can’t maintain support from the Republican caucus if he doesn’t win some concession from the president, then his career is over as leader of the House Republicans. If he makes a deal anyway, to avoid a financial armageddon, for example, then the division of the Republican Party will be completed whether or not Boehner stays on as Speaker because a rump of moderate Republicans will have already joined with the whole of the Democratic caucus to break the back of the Tea Party. That coalition might as well have a leader, and if Boehner doesn’t want the job then maybe someone else does.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.